Episode 15: The Teacher As Music Educator
You can reach Bri Knox on Twitter.
You can reach Mel Steiger on her You Tube Channel , on Facebook, and at her website.
You reach Holly Hudson at hollydhudson@gmail.com
Favorite movies:
Bri: Won’t You Be My Neighbor?
Mel: Monty Python and the Holy Grail
Holly: Hamilton (not a movie, she knows! HA!)
Transcript:
(Transcription by kayla.r.fainer@gmail.com)
Melissa Milner 00:09
Hi, this is Melissa Milner. Welcome to The Teacher As... podcast. The goal of this weekly podcast is to help you explore your passions and learn from others in education and beyond to better your teaching. The Teacher As... will highlight uncommon parallels to teaching, as well as share practical ideas for the classroom.
In this episode, I continue my series related to music. I have spoken to Nico de Villiers, who is a pianist and vocal coach. And last week, I spoke to Dr. Robyn L. Bell, who is a conductor. And now I'm going to be sharing with you highlights of three different interviews with three different music teachers.
The first short highlighted interview is with Bri Knox. And Bree works in Wisconsin, so a very rural area. She works in two different districts. She'll tell you all about that. And then the second is with Mel Steiger. She, up until recently, taught with me in a suburb of Boston. And then my last mini episode with highlights is with Holly Hudson, and she is a music teacher in Buffalo, New York, in the city. We have rural, suburban, and urban.
So after I share these three sort of highlighted mini interviews, at the end, we'll do the zooming in segment. And it'll be the same order. You'll hear what Bri is zooming in on. Then you'll hear what Mel is zooming in on. And then you'll hear what Holly is zooming in on. So that's how it's going to go. And there were definitely some commonalities amongst the three very talented music teachers. I hope you enjoy it.
Welcome, Bri Knox, to The Teacher As...
Bri Knox 01:58
Thank you. I'm super excited to be here.
Melissa Milner 02:00
So what would you like The Teacher As... podcast listeners to know about you?
Bri Knox 02:04
I teach Pre-K through 12 music and band in two teeny tiny little schools up in the northeast corner of Wisconsin. And I'm very passionate about teaching music. Not only actually teaching music, but I'm passionate about where I teach music. I think that sometimes, in our part of the state, teachers end up rotating positions so much.
And I am just so passionate that rural schools and kids in rural schools deserve consistency and somebody who cares about the content area and cares about them. And I love what I do, because not only am I teaching them music and instilling a love of music for them, but I'm watching them grow up.
Melissa Milner 02:51
So you've been there for how long?
Bri Knox 02:52
This is my eleventh year. I teach in one little district, it's my eleventh year there. And I picked up a second district last year. So it will be my second year in the district next door. My passion is building community and kindness. And I get to use that in my teaching. I think because I watched the kids grow up, there's so many lessons that music naturally lends itself to: learning, community and kindness. And I also think that my job as student council advisor really builds on that, too.
Because in our school's student council, we're in charge of the homecoming activities. And we make it so that everybody gets to participate in some way, from the alumni, to the very young children throughout the entire homecoming weekend. So it's a great way for them to build community. I also think our Veterans Day Program is a really great way for them to build community, too. Because there's a meal that's taking place after the program. So the kids read some poetry, and they sing some songs, and they play some songs for the veterans on their instruments. And then afterwards, they serve them lunch.
And we get to have lessons about making eye contact, and saying hello, and saying thank you for your service, and talking to somebody that-- everybody knows everybody in our small town, but maybe talking to somebody that they haven't connected with in a while. So I think that my passion is kindness and building community. And I'm really thankful that I've had the opportunity to do that in my career.
Melissa Milner 04:27
You do a lot. You're doing student council on top of everything else. Wow.
Bri Knox 04:34
Yeah, it's fun.
Melissa Milner 04:37
You mentioned instruments. What instruments do you play? And do you sing, as well?
Bri Knox 04:42
I haven't sang in a long time formally in a group. But I do sing a little bit, I guess just for fun on my own. I play the clarinet. I'm a woodwind player. I end up playing clarinet and saxophone a lot when the kids will play pep band at basketball games and stuff. If they're short a saxophone player, I'll usually jump in there. Sometimes I play trumpet, too.
Melissa Milner 05:04
Wow. So what is your proudest moment so far in your work?
Bri Knox 05:09
I think this last year has been something that I've been super proud of. The school district next door to mine lost their music teacher. And as I was saying before, our school districts around here, they tend to lose teachers frequently. And then they are hard to replace, not just because of the teacher shortage, but I also think because of the rural area that we're in, sometimes people don't always want to live here.
So they did manage to find somebody, but she was more of a choral strength. And with me being more of an instrumental strength, they brought the two of us together. So we actually both work in both districts. And because the schools are so small, we actually combined the kids, too. So they play in band together, and they sing in choir together. And for my school district that I've been working in for 11 years, they hadn't had a formal choir class. So she really got to bring something new to our district, and I got to bring something new to theirs.
Now, unfortunately, this school year didn't really end up the way we wanted it to, because we got closed down for the rest of the school year. But I think what we had started of our school year in combining our programs in a musical way was really special and really amazing. And I'm really looking forward to when we can return to normalcy, and when we can pick it back up, and when we can start again. Because I think the younger kids had seen what the older kids had done with combining bands and choirs, and they were really looking forward to doing it.
So I look forward to when this is all over. And we can keep doing our work, because it's been a lot of work. But it's been something I've been very proud to be a part of.
Melissa Milner 06:53
So how did that collaboration start, as far as were you both on the same page from the beginning? Or did you have to kind of figure each other out?
Bri Knox 07:02
Yeah, the the superintendents from these two schools were actually married to each other. She has since taken a different job somewhere a little bit bigger. There, again, is that theme of people leaving. But at the time, the superintendents were married. And I think that there might have been a conversation there of, well, my music teacher is really good at instrumental music, and my music teacher is really good at choral music. So let's see if maybe we can put them together.
And the two schools that I'm talking about actually already play sports teams together. So they're kind of used to working together. But they had never worked together in this way before in a more academic-- they'd work together athletically, but not academically. So that was different for them to get together and do this.
She and I are quite different from each other. But I think that also adds to our strengths. Because I think where I need some help, she's able to help me and vice versa. And we've really just brought out the best in each other.
Melissa Milner 07:57
I love hearing that. What does a typical day look like for you when you're K through 12? I'm just trying to get my mind around it.
Bri Knox 08:06
I'm at one school on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays and the other school on Tuesdays and Thursdays. And my colleague and I always joke that we're kind of invisible colleagues, because whenever I'm at one school, she's at the other and vice versa. And we're always waving at each other on the highway when we're driving to the other school.
So typically, like at one school, I start my day with the beginning band, and then go to the middle school band, and then have some younger kid music time. I'm teaching Pre-K through 2nd grade general music and my colleague took the 3rd through 5th graders. So we kind of split up the elementary classes that way. So I'll have my little kids, and then I'll go right from the four year olds to the high schoolers.
Melissa Milner 08:52
Wow. So I've got to ask you, what's your favorite age group to work with?
Bri Knox 08:56
Oh, that's a really tough one. I think that's why I stayed at this job for so long. Not only because I'm passionate about rural schools, but because I don't think I could pick an age group. I think I just love all of them. And I think I love the variety, too. It's just when I'm ready to move on to another group, they're right there for me. And I just love them so much, all of them. I couldn't pick.
Melissa Milner 09:21
That's awesome. Music's so important. And how could we incorporate it into the learning we do in our classrooms every day?
Bri Knox
That's a great question, especially with this COVID time where I think teachers are collaborating with different subject areas even more than they were before. I think music is so very versatile. And even as a music teacher, even the best of them, I think we sometimes barely just scratch the surface of everything that we could possibly teach in regards to music.
I think that it fits in so well with every single content area: music and mathematics, music and science, music and social studies, particularly with culture. There's hardly a culture, or an event, or a time in history when music isn't a part of it. So it really fits in very well with that. Same thing with literature and English and language arts. Music, really the way that it's written, can parallel both mathematics and English as far as the mechanics and the grammar and the way that it's built.
So I really think that if any content teacher is willing to share what it is that they're learning, I think the music teacher can really supplement that with music, or a musical concept, or a little bit of music history.
Melissa Milner
Welcome to The Teacher As... podcast, Mel Steiger.
Mel Steiger 10:54
Hi, there.
Melissa Milner 10:56
What do you want The Teacher As... listeners to know about you?
Mel Steiger 10:58
I'm just normal, average, kooky, crazy. I love my job, and I teach music. I teach kids to make organized noise. That's my job.
Melissa Milner 11:11
What grades do you work in? Do you work in more than one school?
Mel Steiger 11:15
So right now, well pre-COVID, I was doing K to 5 music in two different schools. Occasionally I did Pre-K to 5, depending on what the district felt like I should do that year. We do a variety of different things in my classroom. We do ukuleles. We do singing. We do percussion, which when I'm on the second floor, I'm sure the people downstairs just appreciate so much. We do recorders. We make music videos every year.
This year at our school, we did “It's Raining Books”, instead of “It's Raining Men.” And the people in the adjacent classrooms had lots of questions about why I was repeatedly playing “It's Raining Men” in my classroom over and over. But it turned out really great, was just such a fun experience for the kids. And we got it filmed right before COVID hit, so fun project to work on at home.
Melissa Milner 12:25
And I think people need to know that you're legit. You had a green screen and everything.
Mel Steiger 12:30
Yes, my Amazon green screen and lighting kit did come in handy. And I'm just so thankful to work in a school where I can run through the halls with about 50 kids and the camera and lights, and no one questions it, which is nice. I usually see a couple of shaking heads and some shoulder shrugs. And that's about the level of questioning I get, which just makes me so happy.
Melissa Milner 12:57
You've been teaching for a while. You've been doing some amazing things with kids. What's your proudest moment in your work?
Mel Steiger 13:03
I think it's when kids that come in and outright tell me music isn't their thing, and they don't like it. And then I find a way to get them to like it. I know I had a fifth grader this past year come in in the fall and tell me, you know, I really don't like music. I don't like recorder. It's like, okay, that's fair. You don't have to like it.
But he would come down and talk about Minecraft with me. And I would tell him how I would go into my son's Minecraft world, and my son would be building things. And I would go into Minecraft and just fill my son's house with parrots. And he thought it was the funniest thing on the face of the earth. And he would come down and ask me what weird stuff I did to my son in Minecraft that weekend.
And he kept coming back, and I would use that as kind of like a segue to get him excited about being in my room. And then I could use that to kind of get him excited about music. And he ended up, because I was willing to put in the effort to talk to him about Minecraft and parrots and things, he'd give me the extra effort during recorder. And he ended up doing much much better and actually enjoying playing recorder this year, and came up and told me so.
And it was just awesome. Like, hey, look, you're playing it. You don't need my help. Look, you're actually very, very good at this. And he nodded in like, yeah, we're not gonna talk about this, you know? But he knew, and I knew, and he knew I knew. So it made me tear up a little bit, like, yes, I gotcha! But it was Minecraft and parrots.
Well, it's the power of making connections and earning that trust so that he felt comfortable enough to take the risk for something that wasn't in his comfort zone. That's just awesome. Fun stuff like that, it doesn't even have to be related to the subject matter. If you make a connection with the kids, they're willing to give you that extra oomph in the subject matter. It's so important and powerful.
Melissa Milner 15:26
Can you just speak to how you integrate music into other content areas?
Mel Steiger 15:30
So that's actually what got me into teaching music. I actually thought I was gonna be a history teacher. And then I discovered I really didn't like all the essay writing that was required to be a history teacher. And then I thought I was gonna be an art teacher. And that wasn't for me either. But when I got into music, I was like, oh, there's science, and there's history, and there's art, and there's math, and there's dancing. It's like everything rolled into one in this one subject.
This is awesome. I have found something that I can do and that lets me do absolutely everything without having to be committed to anything. This is super. I'm going to do this. Music is math. And I usually hold off until third grade to explain this to kids. And I remember your class, specifically, when I pulled out the slide where I had the fractions laid out, one of your students raised their hand. And they were like, I thought this was music class.
And I was like, oh, it is. We've been doing math since kindergarten, and I just didn't tell you about it, because I'm sneaky. And jaws hit the floor. And I was like, yes, children. Yes, you shall learn the math. It was awesome. But those kinds of moments, where you get to tell the kids how sneaky you've been, and you can draw on all those little prior knowledge nuggets that you've been sticking in there, and they finally get to come to fruition, those are what teachers live for.
And I do that so much, one, because it brings me just all the nerd joy in the world. And two, because the kids get so excited when they make those connections. Their jaws hit the floor, and then you see the light bulb go off. And then they're like, oh my goodness! Yeah, it is the half. That's why it's called a half note, because it takes up half the measure, oh my god! They get so excited.
But then they never, ever, ever, ever, ever forget the vocab. And they never forget the cross curricular connection, like a half note takes up half of the thing. And they can draw on the knowledge in both content areas. So it works out great for math, it works out great for music, and it's an authentic lesson in both subject areas. That's what teachers live for right there.
Melissa Milner 18:19
Welcome, Holly, to The Teacher As... What would you like the listeners to know about you?
Holly Hudson 18:24
Well, I've been a music teacher for about 10 years. Most of that has been in a very urban setting. I also just finished my School Building Leader degree to be an assistant principal or an educational leader. But I returned to the classroom this year, because I think it's really important to have some veteran teachers in there to help our kids through this crazy time.
Melissa Milner 18:46
So can you tell me more about when you're in the classroom? Or are you different levels?
Holly Hudson 18:53
So this year, my certification in New York is Pre-K through 12. I have taught mostly middle and high school, but this year I'm teaching K through 8, kind of a mixture of different music.
Melissa Milner 19:09
Like a typical day for you looks like what? Are you driving to different schools? How does that work?
Holly Hudson 19:16
I've been really blessed. In urban settings, sometimes that is a teacher's life. You're split between two, sometimes even three schools. I've been very blessed to have kind of one school as my home base the whole time that I've been with my district. So I'm not driving to different schools. I'm getting to know my kids and know about their personal life, and their ambitions, and all those things. And it's really been a blessing.
I think it helps in getting to know your kids and helping them further their education. This year is looking very different because of COVID. In New York, if you are singing or playing an instrument, you have to be 12 feet apart. That makes it very hard in a district with 33,000 students. So we have about, give or take, 90 music teachers that service all of those children. And to do instrumental and vocal music at the moment, as you would traditionally do it, is not happening.
The kids will still get instrumental and vocal music to the best of our abilities. But it will not be a traditional band setting. Traditionally, they would have a lesson once a week. They would have a time, whether it's during the day or before or after school, depending on the grade levels, for band or for choir. We just can't do that this year together, you know, 50 to 100 kids in one spot.
Melissa Milner 20:43
Right. So what does remote teaching look like for music ed this year?
Holly Hudson 20:47
Challenging. But as teachers, we always rise to the occasion. So I'm going to be doing a lot of creating with my students. I have students that really love to write. They like to write poetry, they like to rap. So there's no reason I can't take those kind of things that they enjoy and turn it into assignments that have to do with music. We will still be learning the traditional things, counting rhythms, solfege, do re mi, those kind of things.
But there needs to be an element in it that keeps them engaged. Because they're not seeing me, and they're not able to put their hands on instruments and participate in a way that would normally happen. But I actually was just looking the other day, there's a couple apps. I can't remember the name, but there's one that shows a xylophone. And you can even hit more than one bar at a time. So you can make chords.
I've been looking for free apps that I can then propose to our IT department to see if those can be used. And our district's pretty good about looking over those requests and honoring them where they can.
Melissa Milner 22:00
Are you Chromebooks or PC?
Holly Hudson 22:02
They're Chromebooks depending on what grade. So K through 2 doesn't usually have devices. They are now trying to roll out devices to those children because of being remote. Currently, they are getting a packet of information from all their Encore subjects, from their core homerooms. And you can imagine, as a kindergartener, that's a little overwhelming.
So they are trying to roll out devices to those younger kids. Generally grades 3 through 5 or 6 will do iPads. And then middle and high school get the Chromebooks.
Melissa Milner 22:39
Where exactly do you teach? And what is your population? Is it diverse?
Holly Hudson 22:43
It is extremely diverse. So I teach in Buffalo public schools in Buffalo, New York. The school that I was at two years ago, last year, I did my administrative training at a bilingual academy, Frank Sedita Bilingual Academy, so Spanish speaking, English speaking, but also a diverse population of refugees. Buffalo, especially the west side, is a huge place for refugee families. They come and relocate.
When I was a teacher, prior to my admin training, I was at International Preparatory School. And we had 28 languages spoken in that building. There are students from all over the world. Lots of them have been fleeing conflict zones.
And in fact, last year, the valedictorian and salutatorian of that class came from Syria. They're a brother and sister. They came here not speaking English. They were both in my music classes. They learned English. And not only did they learn English, but they learned very well and became valedictorian and salutatorian.
Melissa Milner 23:52
That's amazing.
Holly Hudson 23:53
Yeah, it's amazing. So then the school I'm at this year doing K through 8 is called West Hurdle Academy. It's also on the west side, kind of in the northwest zone there in Buffalo. And lots of Somali and Quranic Arabic is spoken, just a whole menagerie of languages and cultures. And it's really awesome to be part of such a diverse group.
Melissa Milner 24:21
As a music educator, do you get to have students share the music of their culture? Do you research and try to bring that in? And how do you try to work towards some equity?
Holly Hudson 24:33
So I do. And what's cool about that is not only do I do my own research and then teach them something, but I learn so much. Depending on what students I get each year, it might be a different culture. It might be the same culture, but they're from a different region, and so they do things differently. And I get to learn so much.
I did a whole African drumming unit when I was at International Prep, and I had students that were from Ghana actually. And it was so cool, because we got to talk about the seed pod rattles, things that I know about and use. But this is something that this child had seen every day.
And coincidentally, I live out in the country actually. We have goats. My daughter shows goats. And I brought our goats in, thinking it would be fun for the kids to see because they live in the city, and they don't get to see a lot of animals. And I had some of those children crying because they missed goats. They had not seen goats.
It never occurred to me that in their home country, they walk around like cats and dogs do here, you know? So I have a beautiful picture of a small child making a little heart sign with his hands in front of my goat's face.
Melissa Milner 25:54
Aw!
Holly Hudson 25:55
And he said, I haven't seen one since I left home.
Melissa Milner 25:58
Wow, that's so powerful.
Holly Hudson 26:01
Yeah, it's not only just music, but you just learn so many things about other people's way of life and way of thinking. And to me, it's super cool.
Melissa Milner 26:12
Do you have a proudest moment, or some things that you're most proud of, that have happened in your work?
Holly Hudson 26:19
I'm just really proud of my kids. My graduating seniors that have gone on to do things, I've had some that were on a path where maybe they weren't going to graduate. And we built a relationship to the point where I was kind of more of a mom to them, and push them. And I still get texts, phone calls, messages on social media. Hi, Mom, this is what I'm doing now. They call me Mom.
And I think in 2019, I was awarded the Buffalo State College Music Educator of the Year. And I was nominated without my knowledge by some of my students. And that just meant more to me than I can even tell you. Because I don't need recognition from anybody I work with. But to know that I am helping my students, that's the goal. So I was really proud of that. And I'm just really proud of my kids.
A lot of them have come here from not really good circumstances in other parts of the world. And some of them may be born into circumstances that aren't great here. And others of them have the world at their feet. But all of them give me the same effort in general, and that makes me really proud.
Melissa Milner 27:34
Hi, everyone. It's Melissa. It's time for the Zooming In segment. This is where I ask whoever I'm interviewing what they're zooming in on right now.
[ZOOMING IN SOUNDBITE]
Bri Knox 27:47
Well, with COVID-19 and with the different school year ahead, I am looking at zooming in on how I'm going to teach my classes next year, particularly band and performance based ensembles. I kind of look at it almost like a Choose Your Own Adventure novel kind of a thing. Because like I mentioned before, there's so many different ways that you can teach music, and there's so much to learn about.
I'm zooming in on different areas of interest - music theory, music composition, different programs that I can find with almost no money - to see what I can do to help students hone in on maybe a different interest that they have that isn't so heavily based on performance and concerts.
Because while I can record them playing, I don't know what the reality of next year is going to look like as far as, can we all be playing at the same time? Is our space physically big enough? I'm hoping that with what I'm working on right now, I can give the students enough options to be interested and to see that they can learn this content in a different way than they had been before.
Mel Steiger 29:05
Right now, for me personally, I needed to find something to take my mind off of all of the craziness in the world. So I know, over the span of March to June, I had started a YouTube thing and did The Secret Chicken series of rhythm activities for kids. And that was really, really fun. So I'm going to continue that in the Fall.
But I also wanted to just learn something on my own. So I bought a used mandolin at a pawn shop. And I've been trying to teach myself how to do that. I've been working on some watercolor stuff, working on some crochet stuff, and then just really trying to learn some more digital stuff. Because it seems like that's how the world is a-turning right now.
I don't know if you remember this from back in the day, but there was this show on Nickelodeon called Weinerville. And they had these little puppets, and then people would stick their heads on top of the puppets, and there would be little hands and these gigantic heads. And it was the funniest thing I think I've ever seen. And there was a meme that popped up on Facebook like two weeks ago, and I've been thinking about it.
And I think for the Fall, I'm going to try to do something like that. I know in one of our staff meetings, we had talked about wearing masks and how the kids are gonna have problems hearing us. And me personally, when I'm faced with adversity or something scary, I deal with it with humor. Because it's just so much easier than dealing with it with fear.
So I'm thinking, wouldn't it be fun to talk about how to project, and wear a mask, and keep your voice happy and healthy. But what if I did it in the style of Weinerville on Nickelodeon, and just shared that with colleagues. Because one, everybody needs to laugh. And two, I think that would be just so much fun to do.
Holly Hudson 31:28
We're working on making sure kids can actually connect. We have some kids that are having technology issues. We need to iron all that out. I've sent messages saying, if you can't get in and log in with me right now, that's okay. But keep messaging me and letting me know what's going on. The other thing that I'm really zooming in on is, like I said before, just kindness and compassion.
Some people, this is so new to them, being remote, and being home, and being without their friends, and all these different variables. And I have a 15 year old and a 7 year old. And I have one that thrives in this environment and could do it all day long. And I have one that is crawling the walls, because she misses her friends and the school setting and the environment.
So I get it, it's not the same for everyone. And I want to zoom in on the fact that however you're feeling, and however things are going, that it's okay. And we'll take it from the point that you're at.
Melissa Milner 32:35
I hope you enjoyed this very different kind of The Teacher As... episode. It was a little experiment on my part. I wanted to hear from three different music teachers from different areas of the country. What's missing that I usually have in my episodes, two parts. There is a favorite movie question, and there's how to reach whoever I'm interviewing, so Twitter handle, etc.
So what I'm going to do is I'm actually going to put that information in with the podcast notes. So if you go to theteacheras.com, you will find what Bri and Mel and Holly's favorite movies are. You will find the transcript of this episode. And you will also have all the information you need to contact them if you'd like to talk to them and get more information about what they do.
All right. This was really fun. I hope you enjoyed it.
If you enjoyed this episode, and have not done so already, please hit the subscribe button for The Teacher As... podcast so you can get future episodes. I would love for you to leave a review and a rating, as well, if you have time. For my blog, transcripts of this episode and links to any resources mentioned, visit my website at www.theteacheras.com. You can reach me on Twitter and Instagram @melissabmilner. And I hope you check out The Teacher As... Facebook page for episode updates.
I am sending a special thanks to Linda and Lester Fleishman, my mom and dad, for being so supportive. They are the voices you hear in the Zooming In soundbite. And my dad composed and performed the background music you are listening to right now. My intro music was "Upbeat Party" by Scott Holmes.
So what are you zooming in on? I would love to hear from you. My hope is that we all share what we are doing in the classroom in order to teach, remind, affirm and inspire each other. Thanks for listening. And that's a wrap!